To all you people hoarding ammo...


Guest goldstudmuffin
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Guest goldstudmuffin

I saw this on pagepage... I think he meant the 2nd amendment.

What else are you guys hoarding? Gold, guns, food, water, money!!! :spank:

Stop your hoarding... so that will leave more for me!

http://phoenix.backpage.com/SportsEquipFor...wAd?oid=4728928

To all you Whoarders who believe in the 1st amendment...or at least I thought you did. I am a gun owner and yes a conservative....this was put in here as an opinion expressed by a gun powder company. It must have struck a cord with those who are Whoarders..

Subject: Whoarders

The shortages are very real. There is not enough product to meet the irrational, mindless demand.

There is no giant purchase by the military. There is nothing being added to primer or powder to make it go bad in a short time. There is no vast left wing conspiracy. There is no immediate threat of legislation.

There are mindless, ignorant, irrational people hoarding huge quantities of primers, brass, bullets, powder, ammo, and guns. Period. The end. I know that there is price gouging going on but it is not by the manufacturers. Their price lists have been fixed since last October or before.

As for those who say" just build more plants and hire more people" you obviously have never run a business and have absolutely no idea what it would take to build a plant, hire and train the people and get into production. If you did have knowledge of business practice, you would know that no business can afford to be prepared for irrational panic purchasing of any product. You would also know that it takes years to get the approval to build new plants and that the government will probably never allow a new powder or primer plant in the U.S. Too many environmental hurdles. All plants are making all the powder possible. This is not like making pasta. You can't just add more flour water and eggs and get more powder. It takes time.

The blame for this mess falls squarely on panic driven buyers who read the internet and think there is truth to these lies. Before you pass along a baseless rumor as fact, call the companies involved and ask. We will tell you the truth. We have nothing to hide.

Here is another truth for you. Most of the firearms industry is made up of small businesses employing less that 100 people. There are many of these small businesses in danger of failing in the next few years. What happens when no one buys primers or powder or bullets or brass for the next 2 to 10 years because they hoarded so much? The answer is pretty simple. These companies will go out of business because there is no cash flow down the road. Oh, the profits are nice now but when the panic is over no one will be buying.

Every day we get many calls from people who have purchased 100,000 primers or 200 pounds of powder and they want to know about long term storage. These people are not coming back anytime soon as a customer. We are also getting a significant number of calls from people saying they have purchased a lifetime supply of powder. They will never be back to purchase more.

And, just something to think about. if you are one of those hoarding you are probably in violation of federal, state and local laws and your homeowners insurance will be of no value should you have an incident.

Got questions or don't think I know what I'm talking about? Call me 800-622-4366 ext 110 Monday through thursday 7:00 to 5:30 Central. And no, I can't help you get any primers or powder. I can't even get enough for my wife and I to shoot this year.

Birdshot

Hodgdon Powder Company

Some common reasons for community removal are:

Erkel.jpg

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Besides not knowing how to spell "hoarder" and getting the wrong amendment he is also wrong about how to run a business. His company is facing a reality that was caused by the likes of Feinstein and Pelosi. People who watched the bogus piece on 60 minutes and heard Feinstein say she would wait until the time was ripe then push her gun control agenda. The cause is real but in reality the people of America are not buying in to the gun control lobby and support is at an all time low for gun control or we would already have it from the new leaders. As far as business is concerned if they are worried about collapsing they should be investing every profit dollar in a reserve for future adjustments in their business model. I have done my share of hoarding and am glad I have a safe full for me and my grandson. Not so worried about the government but the threat of riots down the road when people realize their standard of living has been sold to China to get us in line for the world economy. Anyone who thinks we can bring the standard of living up for the "have nots" without bringing the exact amount down for the "haves" is dumber than a rock.

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Did anyone see the new report on CBS last night about the Nation Wide Ammo Shortage? Maybe ammo will be traded like dollars, for mike and bread? Grubstake Got me enogh to feed the forums, very well for a month or soo. Reload,reload, reload! Grubstake

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Guest goldstudmuffin

I didn't see it Grubstake.

Did you see the mobile photo radar driver here in Phoenix that was shot dead today? No weapons band and or ammo band would have stopped this nutjob. Now the liberal media and Obama's law makers will use this to there full advantage to try to take the law biding people's rights to bear arms.

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maybe I can sell my nato rounds back to nato.

I made a crossbow once, using a leaf spring from an old jeep. I used a boat winch to pull the string. for arrows, i used 3/8" steel round stock. not all too practical, but would penetrate cinderblock. Never found any of the misses.

Next thing you know, they'll outlaw carbide cannons. even the M-80's they still sell for game control aren't the same recipe they once were. what's next to go, fertilizer and powdered drano?

Maybe the problem is that the population is too full of airheads, politicos, and peabrains. If you look at people as some sort of virus, the earth by going into global warming is trying to control the infection. I can only wonder why all the green organizations aren't lining up for euthanasia. If they want to save the planet from itself, it's the only truly responsible thing the sierra club and nature's conservancy, and the like could and should do. the earth will take care of itself. it and the animals always bounce back after the viral people are reduced. along with the greens, line up all the politicians whose cumulative 'service' (oxymoron) totals more than 9.99999999 years. they got us here, now's their chance to get theirselves out.

next thing you know, they'll outlaw flatulence and pinto beans

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Under "Did You See" Put the prices of SKS,s and AK-47,s doubled on the for sale pages over the weekend and the only 7x62x39 ammo for sale is old russian armor piericing at $1.00 a round, you just can't find good ammo.

Did anyone see the TV report of a Marine arrested at an airport with a live granade and some model rockets motors? I heard it on CNN on sat but by the time I got to the TV there has never been another peep about it??

? Homeland security test gone bad?? Hush up for some reason. Any way if it was true I would suspect a plant to reinforce NPs report that all vets are terroists suspects.

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Yup, this shortage is sure a royal pain in the behind. It happened before in the 90's and people starting buying up all they could find...and some of them later sold their "stash" at a loss once the supply caught up with the demand.

I shoot competetively and go through a bunch of reloads every month and I am getting concerned that I will run out soon. Some of my fellow shooters are running into the same situation and we've had to adopt rule changes to incorporate 22rf into our matches because primers are in such short supply...

Firearms too are being bought up like never before. Try to order a Glock or black rifle...good luck! And hopefully you will receive it within a year.

So anyone with spare small pistol primers...I'm buying! I USED TO go through about 1k/mo...but not anymore... :(

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Guest goldstudmuffin

Gaine,

I overheard a salesman at Sportsman Wharehouse say everytime a new shipment of reloading components come in people clean the shelves off the same day. It seems people who don't even shoot but have lots of cash view ammo as a comodity to buy up at current prices and sale later at a profit. But remember all the generators that were for sale after Y2K. :spank:

Here's one of my favorite websites for reloading, I hope you can use it.

http://stevespages.com/page8a.htm

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Thanks for the link Russ! You can never have enough "recipes"... Primers have practically become extinct here and popular powders too. I'll be running out of primers shortly unless our club finds some soon. We usually order components in bulk but the wholesaler is out and doesn't know when he'll be receiving more. I am starting to see people selling primers for $10/100... :angry2: I hope I never become so desperate that I need to kowtow to them but... At least I know I will always have bullets since I cast my own...then again, "the powers that be", want to outlaw lead use! Now what was Grubstake Gary saying about crossbows....

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A lot of my friends shoot BP but I've resisted. Too many toys as it is... As for real BP, I live in year round 70% humidity so not good climate for BP. Most use BP substitues like Pyrodex or tablets... But definately an option. Maybe one of those high tech rail guns! OR METAL STORM! Check out this video and search for Metal Storm from our other favorite continent, Australia! Awsome firepower!!!

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Here's some info. or more gas to throw on the ammo shortage issue from USCCA (United States Concealed Carry Association) Kind of long but

Some More Ruminations

on the Ammo Shortage...

by Tamara K.

of booksbikesboomsticks.blogspot.com

Die Time: In comments yesterday, Ed Foster mentioned "die time". This is exactly why you can't get, for example, .380 right now. At most manufacturers, the machinery they use to load .380 (which uses different "dies" to load different calibers) is only used for that purpose for a small portion of the year; the rest of the time it's used to load more high volume stuff, like 9mm. They churn out .380 for a couple of months, say, at the end of the year, and it's enough to hold the market over 'til the next winter.

Rumor has it that this past year's demand for 9mm FMJ was so great that Winchester didn't bother tooling up for .380 and kept the presses pumping out 9x19 ball. Even if the other two companies didn't do likewise, what percentage of the .380 market do you think that Winchester represents? Federal and Remington certainly don't load enough to take up the slack, and that causes the supply to crash to nothing.

Case Lots: Believe it or not, the kind of people that read gun blogs, post on internet gun forums, go to the range every weekend, and name their gun "Vera", are a small minority of gun owners. For fifteen years I tried to convince Joe and Jane Public to buy ammo by the case. I failed miserably. No matter how much you explain the price savings when buying a thousand rounds at a lick, or the fact that ammo doesn't go bad, most people would look at you and say "I don't know, $100 seems like a lot of money, and what am I going to do with a thousand rounds of 9mm?"

The ammunition manufacturing and supply pipeline is simply not set up for the average consumer to walk into Wal-Mart and buy two cases of ammunition. If your average shooter normally bought 100rds/month to take to the range and decided to buy two cases instead, "just in case", he has just bought more ammunition at one lick than he would normally buy in two years. Think about that for a second, and then multiply it out over several million shooters suddenly buying way outside their normal pattern.

Production Capacity: The manufacturers are running full tilt. The only way they could make more ammunition is to build more plant, and they are not going to do that for several reasons. The first is that this bubble will contract sooner or later. Joe and Jane Sofaspud are going to realize that they really don't need 10,000 rounds of Winchester .45 in the basement, and that minivan payment isn't getting any smaller. They'll sell it to Annie Appleseed and Ivan Ipsc and demand will cool down.

The second reason they won't build more plant is financial. Remember that economy thing? Yeah, well it's still bad. Business loans aren't really easy to get right now, especially for businesses that are square in the middle of the Media-Congressional Complex's crosshairs. When the stroke of a pen could cut your sales by 50%, you are not what lenders call a "good risk".

Supply & Demand: Right now prices are high not because of transport costs or raw materials costs, which drove the price spike of '05(really an honest adjustment, as ammo prices had stayed almost artificially flat for the better part of a decade,) but because of simple supply and demand. If I put my widgets out for $1, and the first guy that walks in the store buys them all, I'm obviously not charging enough for my widgets.

As demand stays high and supply stays small, prices keep going up. They will go up until they become high enough to cool demand. As demand cools, supply will build back up. In order to move the new supply, prices will come back down somewhat until they reignite demand. This is Econ 101, folks, and it's as predictable as 32 ft/sec² or π*r².

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I recently got into reloading ammo with a friend who has all the equipment and has done it for years. For a long time ammo has been getting more expensive - like a lot of things. The price of metals like copper and zinc that go into brass have skyrocketed in recent years, and brass has skyrocketed as well. Thats why I am going to reloading myself. If you havent bought much brass or ammo in a while, prices are way up - you will be astounded if you havent been watching. A lot of places are cleaned out and have nothing to sell. I went to a large full line sporting goods store here in Reno on Saturday. They carry all kinds of reloading stuff normally - its a big store. They had no primers for rifles or hand guns - none whatsoever. They had no powder for rifles or hand guns - none whatsoever. They had probably 60 plastic tubs they normally keep their brass in - probably 95% of the tubs were empty and the rest had a few bags of odd sized calibers that few people fire. Also this last Saturday I went to a large gun show at a big Casino here in Reno. They have parking for thousands of cars - acres and acres of parking. I got there at around noon and drove around the parking lot up and down the rows for 15 minutes - and I never found a single open parking spot. I saw other guys driving all around in the same predicament. I finally gave up and decided that if there were that many people at the gun show I probably didnt want to wait in the lines I would need to wait in to see it.

Our politicians have created a bubble in ammo and reloading equipment, and created a run on all the available supplies. Its possible that maybe you can wait a year and be able to buy ammo or reloading supplies cheaper. Then again, I expect that all the money we are pumping into the economy will cause increased inflation, not cheaper prices. Higher taxes and other gifts from our government (maybe even a tax on ammo and ammo products) will also increase prices. Wait at your own risk! Who knows what will happen with the politicians we currently have in charge - I think if it wasn't for the consitution, a lot of them would vote to ban all guns and ammo period. Nothing will happen inthe short term, but there is nothing to stop our daft and moronic politiciants in Washington from taxing ammo to death just as they have done with cigarettes. The run or bubble will continue to grow in the short term, but who knows what will happen in the longer term.

Those are my experiences, I'd be interested in your opinions.

Chris

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REVOLUTION TIME!!!! maybe I shouldnt say that, I could be arrested for being a domestic terrorist, even though I am a veteran, and would have died protecting my own country, and still would. Dave

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I meet a guy here in Prescott several years ago that grew up in Poland. He was just a kid when he was sent to a concentration camp called Auschwitz. I asked him if people in Poland had guns to defend themselves. He said "People did have guns, but you don't understand tyranny. After the Germans invaded they interrogated the population. The Nazi's lined people up on the street, then asked each one if he/she knew anyone that had a gun. The first person in the line said no, so they shot him dead. Then went to the next person in the line and asked them the same question. That person said no, so they shot her dead. The third person was asked the same thing and in fear of his life and his childrens lives, told them of a friend that he knew who owned a gun. Under the interrogation the Nazi's found out where the gun owner lived and went to his house and shot him dead, then took his guns away.

Guns and ammo, won't do you any good in the above situation, if others know that you have them. Just some wisdom from the past.

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