Reno Chris Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 AMD - The placer gold is coming from rock contact zones. The important ones are Schist -Greenstone and Granite-Greenstone. It would be helpful to the prospectors to be able to recognize these rocks the the contact zones. The soils will be high in iron because of the greenstone. It would probably be about impossible to hunt these with a VLF type detector. Any of the PI detectors made for gold would get the majority of the nuggets. But is seems that no buyers are interested unless its a minelab with a little window (the 4000 or 4500).The coil used also makes a huge amount of difference in how a detector will perform. Sandy - because the demand is for the 4000 or 4500 models, prices for a unit like the 2200 have not increased. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reno Chris Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 AMD - The placer gold is coming from rock contact zones. The important ones are Schist -Greenstone and Granite-Greenstone. It would be helpful to the prospectors to be able to recognize these rocks the the contact zones. The soils will be high in iron because of the greenstone. It would probably be about impossible to hunt these with a VLF type detector. Any of the PI detectors made for gold would get the majority of the nuggets. But is seems that no buyers are interested unless its a minelab with a little window (the 4000 or 4500).The coil used also makes a huge amount of difference in how a detector will perform. Sandy - because the demand is for the 4000 or 4500 models, prices for a unit like the 2200 have not increased. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DolanDave Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 Talking to my friend who is a technician at Minelabs in Las Vegas, he said they are approx 1000 units behind right now on the gpx4500, and most of the demand has been coming from Russia, and Africa. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rexb Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rexb Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 Here's Jimmy Sierra trying to find a partner for selling Whites in Sudan, posted a couple days ago. Sounds like the TDI would be the only good option over there as far as Whites are concerned.http://www.expat-blog.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=19538 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Herschbach Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 Hi AMD,A lot of us here have used many of the Minelab units. They are essentially the same detector, refined over the years. But the differences are pretty small from year to year. Some debate that on large gold there has really been no improvement at all. The fact it is subject to debate tells you how small the difference is. The newer units do have better sensitivity to very small nuggets, but I suspect that is not the main issue here.I think most of your people would all do just about as well with any of the following detectors:Minelab SD2100 or SD2100v2, Minelab SD2200D or Minelab SD2200v2, Minelab GP Extreme, Minelab GP 3000, Minelab GP 3500, Minelab GPX-4000, or Minelab GPX-4500. Give me any of those, send me where the gold is, and I will do well. Only the SD2200v2 and GPX-4500 are currently available new - all the rest would have to be purchased used.Next in line available new with less performance but also a lower price are the Garrett Infinium and White's TDI. Another unit that would be comparable is the Eric Foster Goldscan 5 but it is a rare unit. Many Minelab owners look down their nose at these units as they indeed are not quite as good as the Minelabs but they are better than they get credit for. If a Minelab simply cannot be had, get one of these. I would recommend the White's TDI because it can use Minelab coils and so would work with all the coils these people already have. If their Minelab control box died, the TDI would be a relatively inexpensive backup unit. I'm sure those detectors are getting a hard workout, and any failures may be impossible to repair given the situation. So an inexpensive backup would be a very wise thing to have.I must say having met a few people from Sudan that their English was better than that of some people raised in this country!Steve Herschbach Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grubstake Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 I looked on ebay last night, a guy called: playboycash has a 4500, that was already up to $7500.00 and he was from NJ. he said he had 10 more brand new units to sell if the one he was selling did ok. Now where did someone from NJ. get that many 4500's? Grubstake Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amdmakki Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 I can't thank all of you enough for the help and support you guys are giving. Chris & Steve thank you for the detailed information. I'm trying to get other Sudanese people to join the Forum and learn. Some people have this feeling that asking for help makes you uneducated. Not at all, learning should be the real hobby of any Human. I hope others will join and learn from the experienced. It only makes you better at what you do if anything. There is no loss.Steve, Thank you for the compliment. Languages and cultures is my hobby. I do speak English, Arabic, a bit of french, little of Indian (urdu) and looking for others. Maybe RussianI do understand totally that other previous PI's from ML would do the job and starting to hear from many others awakening that they are starting to know too, (probably this forum had alot to do with it) Good first step achieved, but that in my opinion is not the practical answer. Why I say that? I think any ML machine is not possible at the moment for any one looking to start hunting now for a number of reasons. 1. (New) Lets forget about the GPX 4500 and the SD2200V2 as that is in waiting lists from 3-5 months. Might be different in States and OZ land, but as for Middle East & North Africa that is the figure. Any Dealer in USA knows that you can not ship to other countries according to ML2. (Used) That is definately not easy for any of the ML machines being it from SD series upto 4500. Other than half of them being scams, there is the other reason where prices are ridicilous as for the GPX's. If people start also demanding the other lower machines down to SD, then there would be no difference in Price. Trust me on that, all you'll see is that the rest of the world will increase Scams and People who own SD's will think they can also raise the price more than what a GPX is selling for right now. Now this is just my prediction but it would be great if Used legit sales of SD's upto GP's would sell at a reasonable price. I doubt that would happen. Like i said all you'll see is a market dishonesty and high crash in 6 months when all this is over.Hats off to Minelab for such a product that everyone believes in, but considering the situation Steves advice on next in with the Whites TDI, Garreth Infinium sounds like more of a solution to me. I know the next questions they'll be asking or wanting to know is how much they are missing out not having a Minelab machine. So the real question is How much they are missing out with not having any Minelab machine? Now that we have a brief Idea of the kind of Ground existing in Sudan and that this not an oldtimers ground but considered Virgin Grounds just 5 months ago with Big nuggets Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Porter Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 ....... Next in line available new with less performance but also a lower price are the Garrett Infinium and White's TDI. Another unit that would be comparable is the Eric Foster Goldscan 5 but it is a rare unit. Many Minelab owners look down their nose at these units as they indeed are not quite as good as the Minelabs but they are better than they get credit for. If a Minelab simply cannot be had, get one of these. I would recommend the White's TDI because it can use Minelab coils and so would work with all the coils these people already have. If their Minelab control box died, the TDI would be a relatively inexpensive backup unit. I'm sure those detectors are getting a hard workout, and any failures may be impossible to repair given the situation. So an inexpensive backup would be a very wise thing to have.I must say having met a few people from Sudan that their English was better than that of some people raised in this country!Steve HerschbachSteve I think you will find if the ground conditions are anything like what Reno Chris has described then the cheaper alternatives would struggle, Green stones are also the predominant feature here in Australia combined with a semi desert environment and iron is the dominant mineral our detectors have to combat against. With that in mind I would suggest either the Infinium or TDI would struggle especially in inexperienced hands unless the gold was laying on or near the surface in a virgin state and would definitely yield a lot more gold to later Minelab users after the initial discovery. This is not to say the two cheaper options won't find gold just that they will struggle and will leave a lot of gold in the ground if my experiences of these two in our conditions is anything to go by.BTW I don't look down my nose at either of them, in the Infinium's case I put my money where my mouth was but it came up short, I also tried a TDI and had a similar experience although it was better than the Infinium, if the conditions were mild or low in mineralisation not such a problem but when you add large amounts of mineralisation their performance drops off dramatically.JP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredm Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 Amd;a few more rambling thoughts.Mining the miners has almost always been the best way to get rich in a gold rush!!!Just last night I commented to my wife on the many people that have good english, people that donot live anywhere near an english speaking country...I admire the educational system or personal drive that powers that learning.You are likely correct, when the rush is over there will be a dropping market for PI machines...just like the housing and stock market did.Any chance of some pictures of the gold-mining areas? Also, some of the gold and the prospectors would be interesting...As to buying used Minelabs, perhaps you could make an arrangement with some of the local dealers here in the USA...this is not an offer of anything but my thoughts...do what you will.Best wishes to all the poor people, may they find their pot of gold...and keep it!Fred Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rexb Posted November 21, 2009 Report Share Posted November 21, 2009 Here's my little comment, I too failed to read this thread until just a day or so ago. AMD, If local U.S. dealers can't supply new detectors, at least maybe you could stock a crate or two of Chris Gholson's GPX instructional video, or that of Jonathan Porter in your family's jewelry store? I don't know what percentage of folks over there exclusively use Arabic, but I have been lead to believe that a good number of people over there would easily have enough ability in English to get a lot out of the videos, if they have enough dvd players over there. Or maybe someone could just buy a video and then charge admission to see it or host a showing for free. Just a thought, I don't know what obstacles might be in the way of that idea. You would have knowledge of the situation there and what would work, which I lack. As mentioned, they could also do some learning by reading the forum where they have internet access. If dealers have any sizeable quantity of used detectors on hand, maybe there would soon be a market for them over there. However, it is my thinking that they only have a handful of stray used detectors on hand at any given time, and there are the other issues you mentioned as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amdmakki Posted November 21, 2009 Report Share Posted November 21, 2009 By the sound of things and new information keep coming on, I think we are back to square 1 in the research part. Now that we know ground conditions ( Thanks to Chris) and being this is a new country to this Gold Rush and all. I think we should start a new thread since this really went out of its subject to the Original Thread. My fault. Im sure alot of ppl would like to join our conversation but see it like a long thread to get into this late. I mean it took me hours to actually read the whole thread before i get in to it. lol... Don't think others would. Is there any way that Admin could re arrange that to a new thread, so many others can follow, with a new subject linking it to Sudan. I think this would also help other Sudanese ppl into joining the Forum, when they google it. That way you guys don't get bored only listening to my opinions.Rexb and Fred. This answer should give a rough idea to both your questions. You have to understand thats it is illegal now for any kind of metal detecting in Sudan for machines to come in or anyone supporting it. Still you would not believe the amount of people still doing it. Probably the goverment did not find any benefit for themselves by others getting rich. I predict in a while they will do like what happens in Brasil as Eldorado explained in his post.Never the less, the lucky people who have already got their detectors in (and I'm talking about a very big number) can not be stopped and honestly don't care. All that can really happen by goverment officials is that they will confiscate your Machine and obviously your gold nuggets if you have any at that time. So they are taking the risk no matter what! Thats why you will never find a collector. Any gold found will be smelted, hallmarked and sold on the same day, no matter how big the nugget is ( People could have found a nugget making a world record here, if it could be displayed in other countries, but they can't do that) You are taking the risk of your collected items to be confiscated too.So pictures, displaying videos in a shop is out of the question for us here. That also includes a Whites distribution. He can not have the license to do that.Simply its all about secrecy and contacts here. You have to have the right connection to get it in from the airport and then the right connection to find the land. If I go into details how? Then this will take alot of time and i feel people are already fedup with me speaking alot here.....lolJust know where there is a will, there is a way, no matter where you are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Herschbach Posted November 21, 2009 Report Share Posted November 21, 2009 Hi JP,OK, I'll quote myself:"If a Minelab simply cannot be had, get one of these."I have the greatest respect for you JP, but please, how about some help here for these people. You can't get a Minelab - what do you get? Minelab or nothing is not a sufficient answer to the question. I would rather have an original Fisher Gold Bug than nothing. Please don't tell me you can't recommend anything outside of a Minelab if Minelab units are excluded as a choice. These people are poor beyond belief compared to what we expect each morning.No Minelabs, period - what would you take to Sudan?AMD - Wait for JP's answer to my question.Steve Herschbach Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOC Posted November 21, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 21, 2009 You know they are finding large chunks of gold over there. What do you think would happend with a Sovereign with a 15 inch WOT coil on it. I wonder if the ground would be too extreme? My understanding is that the ground conditions are similar to Australia. Being it is theorized that Australia broke off of the East coast of Africa. I would think conditions might be similar to those found in North West Australia ????? After talking to around 12 people who are traveling back and forth to Dubai and Sudan, I can tell you that there is one thing that the people who already have detectors can do to increase their daily finds, and that is to use a larger coil so they can cover more ground. Forget about the depth advantage. I have been told that most users are using the 11 inch DD. I think about that, and I think about the fact that you can cover 2 acres an hour with a 20 X 40 Mothership DD coil on a cart. Using a larger coil would have to contribute to seriously being able to up your gold take. Seems like a no brainer.DocHi JP,OK, I'll quote myself:"If a Minelab simply cannot be had, get one of these."I have the greatest respect for you JP, but please, how about some help here for these people. You can't get a Minelab - what do you get? Minelab or nothing is not a sufficient answer to the question. I would rather have an original Fisher Gold Bug than nothing. Please don't tell me you can't recommend anything outside of a Minelab if Minelab units are excluded as a choice. These people are poor beyond belief compared to what we expect each morning.No Minelabs, period - what would you take to Sudan?AMD - Wait for JP's answer to my question.Steve Herschbach Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Herschbach Posted November 21, 2009 Report Share Posted November 21, 2009 You know they are finding large chunks of gold over there. What do you think would happened with a Sovereign with a 15 inch WOT coil on it. I wonder if the ground would be too extreme? My understanding is that the ground conditions are similar to Australia. Being it is theorized that Australia broke off of the East coast of Africa. I would think conditions might be similar to those found in North West Australia ????? After talking to around 12 people who are traveling back and forth to Dubai and Sudan, I can tell you that there is one thing that the people who already have detectors can do to increase their daily finds, and that is to use a larger coil so they can cover more ground. Forget about the depth advantage. I have been told that most users are using the 11 inch DD. I think about that, and I think about the fact that you can cover 2 acres an hour with a 20 X 40 Mothership DD coil on a cart. Using a larger coil would have to contribute to seriously being able to up your gold take. Seems like a no brainer.DocHi Doc,You are a super nice guy but why quote me on this? Your reply has nothing to do with the quote. But all things being equal larger coil sizes make sense.Minelab units are absolutely the best at this time as prospecting units go, make no doubt about that. But I rebel at the thought that nothing but a Minelab can find gold nuggets. That is nonsense, and if Minelab were to whack me as a dealer for saying that, I'd be fine with it. But I am confident they will not, as in my opinion they are the sort of company that can acknowledge that they are in the forefront and others are behind. I think they can live with the fact that other manufacturers are on their tail and trying to catch up. So for me to suggest that if people can't get a Minelab and therefore I suggest the next best thing I say... so what?Steve Herschbach Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Porter Posted November 21, 2009 Report Share Posted November 21, 2009 Just quickly Steve because I have to head out and don't have time to get into too much detail, you are absolutely right about going for an option that is cheaper if for no other reason it allows people who couldn't otherwise afford it into the fray, but also think of how it would feel for that operator to see what a GPX 4500 using Enhance was picking up behind them (assuming the ground is similar to our conditions here in OZ), bit of a two edged sword me thinks? My comments were purely based on my experiences on the other offerings compared to what I have available here and now in our conditions, I sometimes wonder what sort of gold I might have found with an Infinium for example pre 1995 that was missed by the VLF machines, my gut tells me in some places it would have been considerable.Hope this helps clarify my comments above,Jonathan Porter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOC Posted November 21, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 21, 2009 Sorry Steve,I thought it did have something to do with what you had said, but then, as is usual, I got off on a tangent, and started talking about coils.I had just read your post and hit the reply button. I was sort of agreeing with your comment about if there are no Minelab machines (gold) what could you use. And that started me wondering if you could use a Sovereign. The Sovereign with a WOT coil has always been my favorite coin machine. I thought if maybe the gold was large enough, a Sovereign might work.Personally I don't see why they couldn't use a TDI, or Infinium, or anything that would handle the ground. If the choice is no detector, vs any detector, when there is such a gold rush going on, I would elect to use any detector I could get my hands on.DocHi Doc,You are a super nice guy but why quote me on this? Your reply has nothing to do with the quote. But all things being equal larger coil sizes make sense.Minelab units are absolutely the best at this time as prospecting units go, make no doubt about that. But I rebel at the thought that nothing but a Minelab can find gold nuggets. That is nonsense, and if Minelab were to whack me as a dealer for saying that, I'd be fine with it. But I am confident they will not, as in my opinion they are the sort of company that can acknowledge that they are in the forefront and others are behind. I think they can live with the fact that other manufacturers are on their tail and trying to catch up. So for me to suggest that if people can't get a Minelab and therefore I suggest the next best thing I say... so what?Steve Herschbach Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amdmakki Posted November 21, 2009 Report Share Posted November 21, 2009 Great stuff you guys, thanks again for your support. I have went by rexb's advice also with a little bit of a twist. Instead of making it obvious with an instructional DVD, I hooked up the PC to the LCD, making them read all the advices on the Forum. Today i had 4 people hooked to the LCD reading all the advices you are giving. I think now everyone is gonna go buy big coils after what DOC has mentioned....lolMany thank me and keep on asking who are these people ( that's you people). I tell them these are the most experienced people around the world who have been doing it for years and you should learn from them. Their next question is: And what are they benefiting by this? I'm like nothing, they just want to help. Some look surprised and walk off, Some keep on insisting that i should mention their names and send my regards to you. The best one was a guy who kept on saying God bles them, God bless them, so i thought this guy is a prospector, which led me to ask if he finds the information usefull? he's like son I don't speak english but I just heard.....lol...... Man i love these people they are just simple. Everyone cracked laughing because it was the way he was staring at the LCD and saying it.I hope tomorrow its not gonna be like a cinema and have people ramp the place. My brother would kill me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Herschbach Posted November 21, 2009 Report Share Posted November 21, 2009 Hi JP,You said "you are absolutely right about going for an option that is cheaper if for no other reason it allows people who couldn't otherwise afford it into the fray".Saving money is a nice thing, but right now it is more about not being able to find a Minelab on planet earth. I'm a dealer and I can't get one! So what is a poor guy in Sudan supposed to do?Doc, nice reply. You are scholar and a gentleman!AMD - best wishes to your people. May they have something to give thanks for during our Thanksgiving holiday.Steve Herschbach Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredm Posted November 21, 2009 Report Share Posted November 21, 2009 Just a little reminder...the @ 70 pound Hand-of-faith was found with a garret vlf...many thousands of nuggets were found with Whites, Fisher and Garret detectors, all vlf...and this was in Australia...Pi machines are great now but on new ground even the vlf machines will make better finds than nothing at all...and they only cost a few hundred dollars...Power to the People!!!!Fred Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grubstake Posted November 21, 2009 Report Share Posted November 21, 2009 Nothing wrong with a 2200sd, I have found pounds and my uncle also, here show them these pictures AMD, they were all found with a 2200sd minela. GrubstakeI can also add that the draw back to a 2200sd, is if the soil is as bad as it is here in Mariposa, a DD coil is a must, now on the other hand, a 4000 can run a big mono coil in the same soil, where a 2200 couldn't or can't. The soil we have up here is really mineralised and mono's on a 2200 struggle, to much back ground noise to here the small targets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagdoctor1 Posted November 22, 2009 Report Share Posted November 22, 2009 Another thought, ... think about how many used 4500's are going to hit ebay and such sites when the gold plays out in Africa or they lose access to the land. The prices may drop more than used minelabs usually do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rexb Posted November 22, 2009 Report Share Posted November 22, 2009 Huh, looking at some geological maps, the Egyptians might do well to do some looking on their side of the Red Sea Hills. Seems to me like I see some of the same things on their side of the border, about 87 miles west of Aswan the area labeled "ms" in brown where it contacts "go" in violet looks pretty good to me. It looks like on the Sudanese side of the border the equivalent is where the areas labeled in pink as "Ka" adjoins the red granite intrusions labeled "Y" and the green areas labeled "Nf". I hope they watch out for land mines in some areas when digging. It appears the border is no good with troops stationed along the Halayeb Triangle. Egyptian Geological Maphttp://library.wur.nl/isric/kaart/origineel/afr_eggm1981.jpg Sudanese Geological Maphttp://library.wur.nl/isric/kaart/originee...r_sd2001_ge.jpgHalayeb Triangle:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halayeb_Triangle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reno Chris Posted November 22, 2009 Report Share Posted November 22, 2009 looking at some geological maps, the Egyptians might do well to do some looking on their side of the Red Sea Hills.Very true - the gold bearing formations extend to the north beyond the Sudanese border. Historically gold has also been mined in that part of Egypt.Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam Posted November 22, 2009 Report Share Posted November 22, 2009 Hey Rex & Chris....I noticed on a forum or somewhere that there was in interest for 4500`s in egypt as well...So that will catch on to probably.. or already has, and we just dont know it yet...I think this whole outbreak is neat, and I hope they find many pounds of gold to help enrich thier lives...Oh here it is .. It wasnt a forum , rather just a odd place to ask for orders...scroll down to the inquirieshttp://www.1000metaldetectors.com/minelab-...etector-review/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.