I know I'm going to get shot, but... 2100V2 vs TDI

[lrsafari]

So, seeing the killer deal on the V2, and having been reading some about the Whites TDI, anyone got an opinion/experience as to the "better" detector of the 2?

Although I head "home" to Arizona 1X-2X a year, I am in Sacramento for the forseable future, so that should give you an idea of what and where I will be hunting.

Upside to each unit?

I have the coin in hand, or at least will Tuesday to buy one, although i wasn't in a rush, but the deal may speed up my timeline.

Thx,

Scott

[DigDeep]

You can't go wrong with a Minelab in my opinion.

[wonderer]

Scott Miller,

Depends on what your hunting, gold nuggets or coins............

Minelab gets better depth (gold & trash)

TDI, better depth than VLF, + with some discrimination........After reading the posts great on coinhunting & moderate depth for gold (I'm not sure discrimation is helpfull as mineralization & gold can go hand in hand)(dig all targets comes to mind)....Would love to get one to swing for a week or so...to test myself

wonderer

[nuggethunting]

Hey Scott,

If you're looking for a used White's TDI, I have a friend selling one. He just purchased a GPX-4500 and is letting the White's go. He wasn't happy with the performance here in Arizona with it.

If you were asking me, I think the SD2100 is a much better nuggethunter, especially if you add some aftermarket accessories.

Take care,

Rob Allison

[Brian in AK]

Rob,

I might be interested, how much is he asking?

Regards,

Brian

[cop614]

HI SCOTT

IF YOUR AFTER GOLD??

ITS THE 2100V2

TAKE CARE

JIM WADDILL

[nuggethunting]

Hey Brian,

If you can send me a PM through the forums I will give you his email address so you can contact him. I know he is selling it for sure as he just purchased a GPX-4500 for nuggethunting. Where we hunt the TDI really struggled with mineralization (strange for a PI).

Talk with you soon,

Rob Allison

[lrsafari]

Thx for the input. I am thinking thru my options. I am not in a rush, but the deal on the 2100 is why I was thinking about pushing my timetable up a bit.

Scott

[Digger Bob]

So, seeing the killer deal on the V2, and having been reading some about the Whites TDI, anyone got an opinion/experience as to the "better" detector of the 2?

Although I head "home" to Arizona 1X-2X a year, I am in Sacramento for the forseable future, so that should give you an idea of what and where I will be hunting.

Upside to each unit?

I have the coin in hand, or at least will Tuesday to buy one, although i wasn't in a rush, but the deal may speed up my timeline.

Thx,

Scott

Scott,

I posted this short synopsis on Bills forum in response to a similar question. There's more I could add but this will give you a bit of information. More can be found on the TDI forum if you or anyone is really interested in learning more.

http://tdi.invisionplus.net/index.php?mfor...amp;showforum=3

>>Sorry it's taken me so long to get back onto this subject. I don't have much time but here's a couple of things to consider about the TDI.

While the 2200 is a great machine, gets good depth and is relatively trouble free, consider what the TDI has or does that the Minelab doesn't. And remember, I have and use a Minelab also so I'm not pushing the Whites exclusivly. But I do believe it is a good starter machine. I've turned people loose with only 5 minutes instruction and they have found gold.

Waterproof loops, all Mono. No need for a DD. I have not found any ground it could not work in.

Interchangable loops. All Minelab, Coiltek, and Nuggetfinder loops work with it.

Internal battery. No power cord dangling from the back of your belt to get caught or short out.

Comes with 2 Lithium Ion batteries, good for about 10 hours detecting each.

Considerably lighter overall.

Easily convertable to hip or chest mount.

External speaker, loud too. Headphone jack too, of course.

Almost zero interference from outside sources.

Adjustable pulse delay.

High or Low conductivity switch or both. Useful in trashy areas. Relic and beach hunters love this feature.

Full 2 year warranty which is transferrable.

Made in the USA.

Nationwide network of dealers (not all trained on the TDI yet though)

There's more, but these are the highlights. And remember, the 2200 comes with a DD loop. The 18" you looked at is probably a mono, but 18'' loops can be powerfully tiring to use in a short amount of time. The only real advantage the Minelab has is that it does go a bit deeper, about 15% in my tests. And according to surveys done here and on other forums, the average depth that most nuggets are found in 6 - 8 inches, well within the range of the TDI.

Hope this helps some...<<

Digger Bob

[nuggethunting]

Hey Digger,

I think the TDI is also a great starter PI. Like all PI's they have pro's & con's. I've always been a Minelab guy since they came out. It's hard for me to use anything besides a Minelab since I know what they can do. Not knocking the White's, but it would be like going backwards if I used one over the GPX-4500. The GPX series will kill the TDI on small gold at depth. However, we are comparing a $5,000 unit to a $2,000 one.

Have you had any complaints about the battery life on the TDI? Two guys that purchased them stated they were not getting even close to the battery life that was stated.

I do like the fact you don't have a powercord hanging behind you.

Take care,

Rob Allison

[Reno Chris]

Another thought is that the CA locations out of Sacramento are much more likely to be trashy than those in AZ. The TDI discrimination circuit is the one thing about it which is superior to the GPX4500 (meaning in comparison to the 4500's discrimination).

Someday ML will come up with a PI detector with decent discrimination, but not today.

Chris

[Inhere]

"The TDI discrimination circuit is the one thing about it which is superior to the GPX4500.

Only true If you are detecting for coins or relic's!

Discrimination circuit's are a waste of time on a gold machine.

All discrimination circuit's, Minelab, Whites or anyone else, can still leave gold in the ground.

[Ridge Runner]

Hi All

I have a TDI and next month I'll be in AZ. for as long as I can stay.While I'm there I'll take pictures of any gold are trash I find and what depth it was.Being the TDI is 1/3 the cost of the top end of Minelab I'm sure it won't out shine it.

I've had two other gold detectors both Minelab the Extreme and GP 3500.Now if your wanting to know why I changed well it's American made and I wanted to see if we American's could make a good one as well. Again you can't put the TDI next to the GP4500 being it's 1/3 the cost and should be 1/3 less in electronics.

Chuck Anders

PS Now all you guy's that want to see what the TDI can are can't do just take me to some of places you have found gold.

The best to all!

In my dreams you say.

[Reno Chris]

Discrimination circuit's are a waste of time on a gold machine.

All discrimination circuit's, Minelab, Whites or anyone else, can still leave gold in the ground.

Well, I'd have to say I totally disagree. True, no discrimination circuit is 100% reliable. By your standard, they would be worthless for coin and relic use as well, because those circuits are not 100% reliable either - and they will leave coins, etc. in the ground.

There are plenty of places in the goldfields, especially in populated areas like California, where being able to ignore 90% of the iron trash will give you more gold at the end of the day, even if you do leave some gold in the ground - BECAUSE YOU DIG FEWER WORTHLESS TARGETS. There are 15 million more people in the state of California than in all of Australia combined, and that means more prospectors and more trash.

So nope, discrimination circuit's are NOT a waste of time on a gold machine.

[lrsafari]

Thank you for more great info, and Chris for the NorCal specific info. I PM'd him about the TDI.

As I mentioned, my reason to even ask was the limited deal on the ML's, but unless I find a deal on a TDI, no rush at this time, as I am still in therapy after having both shoulders rebuilt.

Thx again,

Scott

[AZNuggetBob]

Hi Guys, I use both a vlf coin machine and a pulse Minelab for nuggets. When the ground is trashy I use the coin machine and leave the deep gold behind, I hate diggin a bunch of garbage. The pulse minelab goes deeper but is not the best discriminator and your going to have to dig that deep garbage. . and then theirs always the bullets, found most anywhere. AzNuggetBob

[Digger Bob]

Hey Digger,

I think the TDI is also a great starter PI. Like all PI's they have pro's & con's. I've always been a Minelab guy since they came out. It's hard for me to use anything besides a Minelab since I know what they can do. Not knocking the White's, but it would be like going backwards if I used one over the GPX-4500. The GPX series will kill the TDI on small gold at depth. However, we are comparing a $5,000 unit to a $2,000 one.

Have you had any complaints about the battery life on the TDI? Two guys that purchased them stated they were not getting even close to the battery life that was stated.

I do like the fact you don't have a powercord hanging behind you.

Take care,

Rob Allison

Oh, I know what you mean Robb. I started off with a Goldmaster and found thousands of little nugglets. But it wasn't until I got the Minelab that the size increased and the total oz. count went way up. However, the total number of nuggets went down since I wasn't spending so much time chasing the fly specks. But, I preferred the chunks to the specks any day.

The thing also, is that I was rehunting ground that had been cleaned out by the VLF machines, so what I was finding was the deeper targets. So, for the last 15 years that Minelab has been my best friend. I rarely used my old trusty Goldmaster.

And as I stated, I'm not getting rid of my Minelab just because I have a TDI now. I have and use all THREE machines, depending on the area. But I'm finding I pull out the TDI now to check a new area rather than strapping on all the Minelab gear. It's just faster, easier, and more comfortable. If I start getting gold, then I know there's likely to be deeper gold that is just out of reach of the TDI. But, it's not going to be much deeper than the TDI can reach. Only a larger loop will help with the really deep stuff. And it's so much easier to use than a VLF machine in hot ground.

As far as the batteries, I am getting 8 to 10 hours of hunting time on a single battery. So, the two that come with it are good for a full weekend. Now, this is a downside to the TDI; There is no cig lighter charger available for it. They can only be re-charged from a wall socket. It's being worked on to come up with something, but so far, nothing available except a generator or solar panel.

And no, the "discriminator" is not foolproof on gold. But it is helpful in certain areas. I could go into a lot of detail on the hows and whys it is not and why it is NOT a discriminator at all, but that's not for here. It's simply another tool at your disposal that gives you more information on whether or not to dig a signal. It's your choice.

Digger Bob

[Ridge Runner]

Hey Digger

Charging the battery is a easy fix just go to Wal-Mart get you a inverter for about 30 dollars and if you have a Sam's card they have them in a two pack that will do the job.This way you can charge your phone,camera and your detector battery.Most of them have two outlets so you can have both in use at the same time and they have around 400 watt output.

Chuck Anders

[Inhere]

I understand what you are saying Chris but you would only have to dig up one 20oz nugget that your discrimination reckoned was a coke can, to change your opinion. Has happened many times out here, in junky area's.

Might be the reason that some of the nicest nugget's on your forum's over there, are found by guys using 2100's.

Last time I was out, It happened again!

New guy gets a signal, gets a bit tired digging a 14" hole in hard ground, checks using the discrimination, it blanks out, so he filled the hole in.

Tells a mate of mine, who is a full timer what he did, so my mate goes out the next day and digs up a nice 7oz ironstone coated nugget.

So yeah, discrimination circuit's ARE a waste of time on a gold machine.

[fredm]

The issue of descrimination is very different in the gold fields of the USA v the Western Oz gold fields...I would never consider not digging a signal in Oz because there is a real good chance of a thumper.

Now, once I start digging hole I see it through to the bitter end...which in the USA has always ended up being a piece of junk...but they were all too deep for the descrimination on a minelab...which I rarely use anyway.

Surface trash is a cost v benefit proposition but many a big nugget has been left for those willing to dig it all.

Fred

[Steve Herschbach]

Hi,

These types of discussions always miss the point. There are no rules in metal detecting. You have to adjust to conditions, and what works well in some places is does not in others.

The internet is a great place to share ideas. But there are many discussions that fall into the "my detector is best" or "my method is best" because the user has proven it to be true for their location and set of conditions. The problem of course is conditions vary around the world.

Distrust absolutes. "My detector is the best". Sorry, no it is not. It depends where you are and what you are hunting. Thinking one brand or model is best in all circumstances is a trap. "You should never use discrimination" is a similar trap. If you always hunt the same set of conditions it can work for you, and come to seem like a rule. But go someplace different and being set in your ways will work against you.

Anyone who thinks PI detectors are the only thing worth using and that discrimination should never be used, simply needs to get on a plane to Ganes Creek, Alaska. There are always exceptions but in general at Ganes Creek a good discriminating VLF will get you more gold in a week than a PI unit. It is a simple fact but people who have never been there will argue with me all day long about it. As if they know.

Under most circumstances a PI detector may be the best choice, but not all. Under most circumstances digging everything may be wise, but not always.

And to bring it home, thinking an SD/GP detector is a better choice under all circumstances than a TDI is a trap. Metal detectors are tools. If you want to be good at metal detecting under varied circumstances then know that different circumstances call for different tools and techniques. Experience counts for a great deal. The experienced operator of not so good detector A will often do better than the novice with better detector B. The casual observer would assume detector A is the better unit, not recognizing that it is the operator who finds the gold. The detector is just the tool being used.

Steve Herschbach

[apw5746]

Hi,

These types of discussions always miss the point. There are no rules in metal detecting. You have to adjust to conditions, and what works well in some places is does not in others.

The internet is a great place to share ideas. But there are many discussions that fall into the "my detector is best" or "my method is best" because the user has proven it to be true for their location and set of conditions. The problem of course is conditions vary around the world.

Distrust absolutes. "My detector is the best". Sorry, no it is not. It depends where you are and what you are hunting. Thinking one brand or model is best in all circumstances is a trap. "You should never use discrimination" is a similar trap. If you always hunt the same set of conditions it can work for you, and come to seem like a rule. But go someplace different and being set in your ways will work against you.

Anyone who thinks PI detectors are the only thing worth using and that discrimination should never be used, simply needs to get on a plane to Ganes Creek, Alaska. There are always exceptions but in general at Ganes Creek a good discriminating VLF will get you more gold in a week than a PI unit. It is a simple fact but people who have never been there will argue with me all day long about it. As if they know.

Under most circumstances a PI detector may be the best choice, but not all. Under most circumstances digging everything may be wise, but not always.

And to bring it home, thinking an SD/GP detector is a better choice under all circumstances than a TDI is a trap. Metal detectors are tools. If you want to be good at metal detecting under varied circumstances then know that different circumstances call for different tools and techniques. Experience counts for a great deal. The experienced operator of not so good detector A will often do better than the novice with better detector B. The casual observer would assume detector A is the better unit, not recognizing that it is the operator who finds the gold. The detector is just the tool being used.

Steve Herschbach

[Reno Chris]

Steve, I agree completely with you.

If someone said - there are places where discrimination is of no value - I'd say sure those places exist. Western Australia and Northern Nevada here in the states both belong in that category. The trash ratio is low and essentially all the trash is shallow. You can strap on a big coil and cruise for big nuggets - no problem, no worries.

You are right too that Gaines has frustrated a lot of PI "experts" who spend a week digging giant craters to recover deep trash while some guy with a gold bug II gets some nice gold.

In California there are plenty of very trashy spots. There are plenty of places that if you set up like you were prospecting in N. Nevada or W. Australia and put on an 18 inch coil, you'd pick up 2 or 3 targets on every swing, and many times you'd have multiple trash targets under the coil at one time, which produces confusing signals. You'd spend day after day digging nothing but trash with no gold to show for it. What I find with folks who say discrimination is useless is that they simply wont hunt in these types of areas - like trashy areas dont exist. Thats all the better for me, as I'll take the gold they leave behind.

Experience and knowledge are the most important things you can take into the field. You noted that "experienced operator of not so good detector A will often do better than the novice with better detector B" - thats normally true even when the novice has a much more powerful detector. Lot of guys who hunt in one type of environment become very expert in that type of environment, even to the point of assuming that all gold deposits look just like the ones they work. However its just not true. There are many different types of gold bearing environments and its a valuable skill to be able to adapt to each circumstance and work different types of gold deposits.

Discrimination, the ability to go very deep, etc. - these are all capabilities of the tool - the metal detector. Different kinds of jobs require different types of tools. If you dont have the right tool, the job is going to be much more difficult - or you wont be ableto do the job at all.

Chris

[nuggethunting]

Hey Guys,

I can tell you I really thought the PI Discrimation was working until I dug up a very nice gold nugget with host rock at depth. This was a real "eye opener" for me! Since then I've never put any faith into the discrimation. At Moore Creek guys were digging gold specimens up and leaving them right on the edge of the dig holes. One guy several years ago found a nice 3+ ouncer right at the edge of a dig hole. The person dug it up, the PI probably blanked out and they walked away with a 3+ ouncer on the pile.

I've only had a couple of solid gold nuggets blank out, but many ironstone and other host rocks with gold.

I heard about the White's TDI discrimator, but it also "discriminated" out one of my Moore Creek specimens that my Minelab PI blanked out on also.

I would put more faith into the discrimation of any PI if the gold was solid and shallow. If the nature of the gold was specimens I personally wouldn't be using the discrimation.

Talk with you later,

Rob Allison

[Goldman]

Steve brilliantly put!!! Don